13 Oct 2017 Praetor-class Star Battlecruiser 4k by Fractalsponge | posted in: Capital ship, Galactic Empire, Gallery, Star Wars | 67
What are These Giant things at the Sides of the wall
what is the armament of the ship
there is really no stats on the armament of the Praetor in canon or legends (according to wookiepedia) but there are weapons stats in Empire at War: Fall of the Republic, which are: 20 heavy quad turbolasers, 8 medium dual turbolasers, 5 heavy dual ion cannons, and 8 medium dual ion cannons
yeah, but it seems kinda strange for a ship of that size to have the same amount of firepower as an ISD
because it was made after the rusan reformation
find more abt it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxyrhJGg0us
I’ve got my fingers crossed hoping Fractal upgrades this ship next, as he’s done with the destroyers and bellator. Maybe a version scaled to 6.4km (Praetor-III?)
Any plans to do the carrier variant seen here?
Between that thing, Fractal’s Impellor & the Gladiator class, we have a notable number of bow-cutout capitals. Dunno how good that layout is for running-engagement launches, but it might work well for offensives where you deploy small craft then stay broadside-on at range.
I always figured this was where Fractal got the idea for the bow cutout on the Impellor.
Possibly, though there’s also that ‘proto-Gladiator’ pirate carrier from the old Droids toon.
There’s at least one other non-Imperial carrier with a bow cut-out, too: the SoroSuub Liberator-Class
Cripes, now I recall one of your posts WRT the ‘Rebellion’ game mechanics for gauging that thing’s scale & shields/hull/firepower. All told, I’d take one of those over its tonnage in Quasar Fires wherever possible.
Indeed. The wookieepedia numbers look impressive until you dig a little deeper and realize that the exact same game gave MC80 cruisers “360 turbolasers (60 fore, 60 aft, 120 port, 120 starboard) and 200 ion cannon (40 fore, 40 aft, 120 port, 120 starboard).” Except the numbers listed weren’t supposed to be individual cannon, but rather relative “throw weight” in a given fire arc. So the Liberator ends up somewhat undergunned for comparatively sized ships, but has the same troop and fighter capacity as an ISD (going strictly by comparing in-game stats). So more like a fast fleet carrier to the Quasar Fire’s light or escort carrier.
Hopefully Fractal has plans to do it. Maybe also name it an equivalent name to Praetor such as Pretor or even Jurist.
Where’s the bridge? I actually can’t find it.
It is there in front of the cyclinder part but it is quite difficult to see it.
Just in case if anyone wonder how Fractal got the idea of this ship it is base of an Anonymous star battleship#1 also known as Admiral Giel’s star battleship.
Here the reference: http://www.theforce.net/swtc/dagger.html#giel
Although I got to ask Fractal when you said you going to make this ship it was going to be between 7-8km in length here: http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?p=3001376#p3001376 But now it is 6.4km so why did you change your mind about it? (I know it is a old post but I just want to know why)
I used 6.4km but Jason Fry had already decided that it was 4.8km. There’s a range of scaling because the ship is pretty featureless leading to a large possible size range.
Right so the length is not fix ok.
Anyway since your version is 6.4 km then what the carrier variant’s length do you think Fractal?
Just out of general interest, how would a unit of this class fare against an Allegiance or a Legator?
If we go with the 6.4-km. length Fractal was proposing pre-EGtW, Praetor could probably chew up an Allegiance with some wear & tear; they’re extra-punchy for their bulk, but ‘only’ 2.2 km. At 8 km, Legator has a notable tonnage edge, but might be less slugging match-optimized (big hangar cavities, dorsal long-range comm globes), so that duel might depend on luck/initiative.
If this ship was hit by an Ion Weapon like the Hoth cannon, then it will be a big mess to clean up.
The Hoth ion cannon was powered by the primary reactor from one of these ships. It’s quite possible they could trade fire for a while.
Wasn’t said reactor also powering that theater shield? Talk about optimization if you can strip out a battlecruiser reactor & get one destroyer-stopping gun *plus* enough shield to keep Death Squadron *somewhat* off your neck ’till the armor deploys. Granted, the latter depends on whether Vader & crew were bent on taking prisoners…
As to say something about the actually featured ship here:
I love using these guys in Thrawn’s Revenge/Imperial Civil War-mod for Empire at War when I can build them either as the Imperial Remnant or the Pentastar Alignment.
Their range is almost insane and they’re much easier to maneuver than the blocky and clumsy Executors.
Give them one or two VicStars as escort plus a few anti-fighter ships and they can wreck almost everything.
Haven’t actually played the EAW mods, but I’ve watched enough excerpts on YouTube to note how the maps & ‘camera’ (to say nothing of weapon ranges) are calibrated for keeping track of far smaller units. Evillejedi’s ‘Warlords’ gives capital craft far more breathing room (not to mention 3-D maneuvering), though steering ’em can still be a chore and micromanaging fighter squad-scale stuff becomes quite the task.
So wookieepedia stated that this ship was used to hunt down remaining separatist force early in the imperial reign, is that why so many of its weapons are ion, so it could hunt down and disable ships for capture more easily.
That was the Praetor Mk. I which was also already used by the Republic during the Clone Wars.
The ship portrayed here is a Praetor Mk. II, an entirely imperial design which was the successor of the aforementioned one.
So Fractal from the look at the hanger bow there are 4 bays two hanger bays and 2 square ones so I guess 2 wings of fighters but I’m not sure what inside the square bays.
My mistake those hangers are actually smaller which carry only a squadron of fighters each which make it 2 squadrons.
And I also figure out that the square shape hanger bay are for shuttles and transports.
Never mind I was right the first time that it carry 2 wings. (Again late post)
You know, maybe there is a Tie rack system, and there are over 100 Ties (in total) in the big hangars, they look large enough for them
So Fractal what do you think of the Republic class star destroyer use by the New Republic?
The ship is 1,250 meters in length and it said to have half and cost and 1/5 crew size of the Imperial/Imperator I but despite that it have 20% more firepower than the Imperial/Imperator I but still outmatch by the Imperial/Imperator II and various super star destroyers. the armament is 40 heavy turbolaser batteries, 40 heavy turbolaser cannons, 20 ion cannons and 10 tractor beam projectors it also have a class 2 hyperdrive. And it carry up to 72 fighters and 3,200 ground troops.
I know you going to say the Republic having 20% more firepower than the Imperial/Imperator I is bullshit for which I agreed with you.
Half the* cost of the Imperial/Imperator I.
Well there my another wording slip up.
Happens to everyone. As I understand it, you could *theoretically* cram more guns than an Impstar usually mounts on a Venator-tonnage hull; however, this is likely to heinously compromise the volume you can dedicate to anything *besides* anti-capital action, and the resulting ship is unlikely to have enough juice for every gun at once (or shields proportionate to an Impstar’s, for that matter).
Right although it also say since the Republic need to have a similar weapony to the Imperator it need to have to sacrifice both cargo space and endurance which kinda make it a glass cannon.
Speaking of the Imperator you might have see this before:/revision/latest?cb=20100323185310
I would like Fractal to make this variant but instead of having a superlaser you could replace it with a few hanger bays to make it a Fleet Carrier like the Impellor Or there is no point of making this because the Venators can cover that role right?
That would just be an ISD hull used as a carrier. I’m sure that variant exists, but yeah there are a lot of Venators around to do the fast destroyer-carrier thing.
Yeah though so anyway speaking of Venators Fractal since those ships are carrier-destroyer I wonder what they would be like as a pure carrier (Unless the difference is minor like just a few more fighters like 12-24)?
I’ll admit it’s kinda fun to visualize rapid-reaction squadrons composed entirely of Impstar flavors (say, 1 carrier-cutout type, 1 Dominator, 4 Deuces and a handful of -Is & Tectors for offense). Suppose KDY might try out a sensor/EW-specialized variant packing scaled-down/recessed Legator domes?
My thinking on the Republic/Nebula class is: coast defense ship. Basically take a very heavy armament but fed mostly from capacitor, add minimum engines and peel away armor and fuel until it all fits on the smallest hull possible. High alpha, lower sustained power, average acceleration, low power and crew endurance. Good for sortieing against a raid and then back under fixed planetary defenses to recharge and refuel but not nearly so useful in open-space high power warfare as a ship purpose built for that role. Well in keeping with New Republic doctrine, and a new take on the role I imagine the original Victory I was designed around – attrition/positional warfare around fixed targets (with capacitor fed HTL replacing the massive torpedo battery as a temporary equalizer against larger ships). ISDs must be large because they can do everything well. Nebulas/Republics can be small because they can focus on doing *one* thing well.
Interesting idea but the Nebula will have it worst against Imperator since it is 1,040m in length despite it’s heavy weapons.
The Nebula as a planetary defense destroyer concept only really makes sense against destroyer-range opponents. Anything like a Praetor-II or larger should have an alpha capable of knocking it out in a matter of moments, and the New Republic had to face a lot of cruisers and dreadnoughts.
Victory-I as a positional warfare ship I can buy if we assume the vast majority of CIS capital ships are Munificent/Recusant/Lucrehulk, which either are too small or don’t have decent enough gun arcs to rapidly kill Victory-Is. The old canon had a fleet of Victory-Is catch and destroy a CIS armada of Bulwark battlecruisers in open space as their first engagement, which is pretty interesting. The Bulwark is as ugly as they get, and at 1000m can’t possibly be an actual Star Battlecruiser, but it’s interesting nonetheless. Perhaps they didn’t have enough point-defense to protect against torpedo salvoes, or weren’t maneuverable enough to keep a Victory in their primary HTL arc.
I’d like to see a fractal total redesign of the Bulwark concept, but that’s probably not happening anytime soon.
I think that’s a bit tangential to my argument there. I think it’s a conscious bet on numbers vs individual superiority. Because Nebulas and the like are small with small crews, they can be fielded in big numbers. Of course they work better vs ISDs than battlecruisers – one wouldn’t expect a single Nebula to take on a Praetor. Even a single ISD would be screwed almost as badly vs a Praetor. But if the NR could field 2 Nebulas to an ISD and for a few minutes at least double the ISD’s firepower, then that’s a win in the right circumstances. An ISD would probably string out two Nebulas and defeat them in detail over time if given the maneuvering space, but that’s why I think Nebulas would be tied to system and strongpoint defenses. Victory-class I can see being used the same way – massed fire from many ships with stacked burst firepower to surge bigger ships’ defenses and then swarm them. Not like a Venator individually stands much of a chance vs a combat Lucrehulk either.
This numbers vs big ship thing holds up with lower power to weight ratios on bigger ships. For a conversion like a Lucrehulk, this is likely to be true. In the profound peacetime of post-Ruusan where bleeding edge performance doesn’t matter as much, probably also true. It starts falling apart with really specialized galactic-scale combat oriented designs like Allegiance onward. But you absolutely would not expect such ships to be easy to kill with any combination of (relatively) small craft.
The Bulwark came in different variants, mk I, II and III. The mk I was a 1000m long, but the mk III, the one designated as a battlecruiser, was actually 2500m long and a lot more bulky than its predecessors, being around a km high.
My argument isn’t that an individual Nebula should be expected to fight a Praetor, but rather that in a siege and sortie scenario, the mechanics of shielding favor larger vessels over similar tonnages of smaller ones.
The blockading force in a planetary shield siege should have overall tonnage and power generation superiority by at least a 3:1 margin over the defending garrison fleet. I don’t remember where on the main site this was from, but time-to-kill between capital ships of the same power generation capability is at least 15 minutes, assuming full initial shields and some degree of combat maneuvering.
The problem with smaller ships in this sort of scenario of 10 Nebulas darting out from under fixed defenses versus an Allegiance or other cruiser is that the Allegiance can rapidly cause local shield panel overload on a Nebula and destroy it in probably under a minute, assuming relatively even crew skill. In that period of time, the Allegiance’s shields are still up, and has sustained either no damage or very minor burnthrough.
When the Nebulas have worn down the Allegiance’s shields to roughly 25%, the heavier ship can go to full evasive maneuvering and either withdraw through friendly vessels or just make a combat microjump away to recharge shielding and perform damage control. In this kind of fight, several Nebulas are useless wrecks, but the Allegiance can just recharge shields, refuel hypermatter, and be back within hours at full capability to perform its blockading/bombardment duties.
If whatever Imperial Remnant faction is only bringing 1 ISD to every 2 defending Nebulas in a siege, then sure, Nebulas can be cost effective, but no Remnant/Warlord faction is stupid enough to attack a fortified position without at least a numerical advantage over the garrison fleet, and if the Imperials are attacking a shielded planetary fortress, they’re probably going to be bringing heavier units than ISDs.
I really like your Nebula mesh, but the concept of operations as a planetary defense sortie destroyer doesn’t make that much sense to me.
I’ve been arguing for movement to large high power density designs for high intensity combat on this basis for a long time now. That’s not the point I was trying to make.
We have a clear incompatibility between Nebula tonnage and stated Nebula topline numbers. Armament is set, size is set – so what goes are speed, endurance, maybe protection. No free lunches in ship design. This to me points to the idea of these things as defense boats. Relatively cheap, high surge capability within a narrow range, but low sustained and multirole capability. Torpedo boats vs Cruisers in the real-world old-school way. The cost advantage lets you build lots, and hope you can get those numbers to matter, or at least your enemy to reconsider. If you can’t, then you are in a tough spot. This analogous to the situation that comes up in any of my discussions about the TIE/ln. It doesn’t make either the /ln or the Nebula an intrinsically bad idea, but it makes judicious and far(ther)-sighted employment of either type more nuanced than just “be there and dominate by virtue of intrinsic superiority.”
Equal tonnage of Nebulas might lose badly against an Allegiance in a straight up long fight, but maybe not in short increments where the Nebula swarm can burst a lot of fire into the big ship and even if not kill it, make it face the choice of risking actual damage or withdrawing. You don’t have to win, just not lose long enough to get reinforced. A cheap ship can see off the much more common raid (say a planet has 4 Nebulas and that means a single ISD is in trouble if it doesn’t run, and even 2-3 are not guaranteed to overwhelm the defenders before reinforcements come, especially if the defenders can withdraw back to fixed defenses, and force a superior single ship to risk crippling damage against w-165s or the like.
Yeah, if the other side brings a superior force to play and play for keeps, OF COURSE the inferior fleet is going to have a bad time. The point is to concentrate when necessary, as reinforcements if not as a garrison. Bring the numbers that the cost advantage affords you to bear, and on a strategic basis that might give you an advantage. In the meantime you get presence and low-level deterrence and policing across wide areas that single large ships don’t give you. It’s a perfectly reasonable choice for a defender, rather than an attacker who would seek to concentrate power as much as possible. In a way, all this tells you what the Imperial Starfleet was really meant to do – hint: not counterinsurgency or presence missions.
To pitch into this long-dead conversation, the stated idea for Nebulas was ISD, with more advanced !Republic! tech, stripped of all accoutrements. No more 36k crew, no more massive hangar and large fighter capacity, no more Legion of ground troops with prefabricated bases. Hell, instead of having 6 years of consumables like the ISD, it has only 6 months.
I don’t buy into the coastal defense boat idea, specifically because it’s noted that the Nebula is really expensive, compared to MC90s, and because it’s also noted that it is more advanced and has greater power generation than an ISD. It was basically in LRIP for years until the Vong attacked, and then the MC90 was still favored, from what I can tell.
To double down on the necro, this ‘NR spin on the Tector’ angle still seems like it would make more sense with a roughly Impstar-or-slightly-larger hull plan for all that extra firepower & capacitor/(secondary?) reactor space. I could halfway see Steve’s ‘mass fixed-target alpha strikers’ premise for the Nebulas working well enough to let Mon Cal shipyards start cranking out more Home One-plus-scale heavies for system defense & general fleet presence.
One factor I see missing in the discussion here is Miniaturization.
Just because the Republic-class or Nebula-class is smaller it doesn’t mean that the RSD being 20% better than an ISD-I or the Nebula being able to easily vaporize an ISD-II (and perform well even against some smaller SSDs according to Legends-canon) is nigh impossible or implausible.
Both the Republic and the Nebula are shipclasses created with newer technology and since Miniaturization can arguably be also a thing in the SW Galaxy it is certainly feasible to assume that the RSD and NSD can have the attributes and advantages against the ISD-line of ships due to miniaturized reactors, energy capacitors et cetera giving them the same amount of power in a smaller package.
Also, if I recall correctly, while the Republic-class was indeed available in high numbers for the New Republic, the Nebula was very costly to produce and thus by the time the Yuuzhan Vong came knocking the amount of Nebulas the NR had access to were in the middle three-digit range at best, meaning no more than 500 or 600 Nebulas available at most for the whole Galaxy in the most generous interpretation.
For a galactic state spanning more than a million member planets this is incredibly low.
Assuming equal crew quality & a neutral starting position (neither of which are remotely guaranteed, granted), I seriously doubt capital-scale ‘miniaturization’ will give you a Venator/Victory/MC80-scale ship with the juice to offhandedly wreck Impstars (much less larger first-rate combatants). TIEs seem to be the handiest in-universe example of compact high-performance craft, and they’re still broadly comparable to most Alliance, Clone Wars or neutral starfighters in volume & general performance if not mass. Outside the odd superweapon, SW naval tech just doesn’t seem to involve the energy-output (or efficiency) progression jumps we’re accustomed to from RL mil-history, so smaller capital craft with across-the-board supremacy (as opposed to the differing design priorities suggested above) strike me as damned unlikely.
Even if technological advancement could potentially make reactors, capacitor and turbolasers more compact for the same capabilities, the fuel necessary to efficiently feed all of that would be the same. A Nebula’s fuel capacity would have to be at least equal to the one of a ISD to match it in combat, and since it’s much less voluminous, the only way to achieve that would be to compress hypermatter even further, or else it would run dry far before its opponent.
Even assuming you could increase the efficiency of an hypermatter annihilation reactor, you couldn’t do it by much since it’s already 90% efficient in its standard form.
It was mostly an idea to reconcile what Legends-sources claim with the objective smaller hulls of both the NR Star Destroyer classes.
Then again, if I recall correctly concerning the Republic-class the 20% better than the ISD-I concerns only raw firepower itself, nothing else.
1250 Meters is roughly Venator or Procursator-size so this would suggest a medium destroyer rather than a heavy one.
The RSD is stated to be “overall a much more efficient design” than the ImpStar-line of ships, but since it is smaller and has to retain the 20% more firepower than the ISD-I it has severely reduced cargo space (11,000 tons compared to the ISDs 36,000 tons) and subpar armor for a true capital ship.
Furthermore it can only carry 3,200 troops compared to the ISD’s 9700 and I’ve nowhere seen info that the RSD carries any ground assault vehicles or deployable bases.
Information about its shield strength seems also be non-existent, but in order to survive against an ISD even with its subpar armor it would have to be assumed that the Republic’s shields are either equal or better than an ISD.
It does seem to have some Mon Cal-influences, so maybe it has those better Mon Cal-shields?
As for the Nebula, it is written that it is designed to “defeat any Star Destroyer” one-on-one with the ISD-II being its designated match.
The thing with the smaller SSDs (I guess this means units like the Allegiance, Praetor-II or the Legator) is that the Nebula isn’t supposed to be able to actually defeat them, but withstand their fire for a while so its own fighters and the fighters of accompanying Majestic-class Heavy Cruisers and Endurance Fleet Carriers have the chance to cripple/destroy the SSD.
Considering the small frame of the Nebula (it can carry 60 fighters and has only 1,600 troops on board as well as supplies for only 6 months) I’m guessing the Nebula must have some exceptional shield capacity in order to perform this task.
I’d be very wary about drawing too many conclusions re: ship capabilities based on fluff text (as opposed to stats or onscreen action)-fr’instance, Legends & now Disneyboot-spinoff sources keep noting the Nebulon-B’s supposed capacity to put a dent in Victory-tonnage destroyers, and that thing is far too spindly for any hope in hell of doing so individually. Come to think of it, despite that NR market label the Majestic’s design seems liable to give it very similar power/endurance issues engaging anything bulkier than an MC30 or Strike-class. Honestly, I’m starting to wonder if that “20% more firepower” figure just refers to gun barrel count without regard to how much juice a Republic has for its main arc(s).
Reduced vehicle complements (troop numbers seem far too marginal a factor) might reduce the volume gap somewhat, but I sorely doubt this factor gives the Republics or Nebulas any particular leg up on, say, a Liberty-class Mon Cal when dueling Impstars. As for Mon Cal shield redundancy…easily-replaceable projectors might help for drawn-out duels where bleedthrough damage wears down a ship’s shielding, but getting hammered by Allegiance (or heavier) volleys seems likely to wreck any medium destroyer faster than repair crews can feasibly react (barring lightspeed retreat or reinforcements).
As for armor…I get the distinct impression that while it may help with capital-gun bleedthrough, fighter-yield lasers & lighter munitions (i.e. concussion missiles), proton torpedoes & especially heavy turbolaser/ion bolts hitting bare hull are another matter entirely. Once shields drop under that sort of fire, you either jump out, get swiss-cheesed into a glowing hulk, or ker-splode from a reactor rupture ala that Impstar in ROTJ during Ackbar’s “concentrate all fire” line.
Finally, the whole “survive long enough for your strike wings to kill the battlewagon” angle seems distinctly backwards. Fighters in the movies seem to be exploiting shield gaps opened by capital craft either taking a pounding from other such ships (ROTJ) or concentrating defenses in said direction (R1). If you’re lacking the innate firepower or enough packmates to threaten a Praetor/Bellator/Executor, small craft are unlikely to pound down said heavyweight’s defenses before it does so to you.
Now, none of this means either NR destroyer would *always* be screwed against Imp (Remnant) counterparts-crew quality, maneuvering, numbers and supporting defenses (as noted by our host) could easily be mitigating factors. However, I suspect that besides Fractal’s “system defense mini-monitor” theory, the Republic & Nebula might’ve been at least partly PR gestures on Kuat’s part toward the Mon Cals (if we take the former’s appearance at face value) & major Alliance member worlds (Fractal’s Nebula & Endurance renders sport rather Old Republic paint jobs…).
Stats and on-screen action are rather hard to come by with shipclasses that aren’t used so often in actual material and when there are some instances and even those few contradict each other to a degree you’re left headscratching somewhat.
The old Legends-EU was a confused mess in several different areas anyways and almost all the “New class”-designs were somewhat murky covered.
A Neb B being capable of fighting a VicStar one-on-one? Wat? This thingy is an escort frigate, not an anti-destroyer ship. Even a Venator would probably blast a single Nebulon B apart with ease. I remember Kyle Katarn stating somewhere that a Dreadnaught Heavy Cruiser (that old as heck flying bunker) could take on a VicStar, but a Nebulon B I would put more on the level of a Carrack, Arquitens or at most a Strike Cruiser.
The Majestic is 700 meters long so I would put it in the Vindicator, Dreadnaught and indeed Strike Cruiser range, yet Legends sources claim they could engage bigger adversaries without much problem. Main weapons of the Majestic are 30 Heavy (Dual?) Turbolasers complemented by 20 Ion Cannons and 8 Concussion Missile launchers which sounds impressive at first, plus 20 Laser Cannons for anti-fighter-stuff.
If you take together the Republic’s “barrel-count” you get around 200 barrels of HTLs (40 HTL “batteries” whatever that means + 40 Dual HTL cannons) and at Wookieepedia its the reactor of the Republic that is stated to have “20% more power than an ISD-I”. Reactor power doesn’t translate solely to weapon power though.
Liberty-class Mon Cals were converted civilian ships, weren’t they? The Nebula and Republic are at least supposed to be purpose-built military ships.
The room saved by foregoing vehicles might be used for additional armor or shielding either way, and at least give the Republic and Nebula the juice to get barely even with ISDs, not something even bigger.
I don’t think anyone actually can believe that these ships would be capable of fighting something like an Allegiance or a Praetor one-on-one.
Even the Nebula is just supposed to endure their fire for a while, not to beat them.
If the NR wanted to go against Allegiances, Praetors and similar stuff directly they would need either the 8,500 meter long Meditator-class Battlecruiser (another Mon Cal design, successor of the Home One-type) or the 6,000+ meter Strident-class Star Defenders (developed by Corellia/CEC).
The whole “holding up until fighter swarms do the main job” issue which was apparently also taken up by many EU-authors like i.e. in that one novel where a few X-Wings managed to blow up a VicStar on their own I dare to assume comes from examples like the X-Wing simulation games (X-Wing, TIE Fighter, X-Wing Alliance) where capital ships are often nerfed in order to allow players to blow them up single-handedly.
I remember playing X-Wing Alliance and especially going to try and blow up ISDs by myself in order to get massive bonus points because they gave so many.
Of course it is illogical that fighter can do so much damage on their own.
Funny thing is they aren’t even from Kuat. The Republic class was produced by Rendili StarDrive and the designer was the same guy who designed the Victory Mk I.
The Nebula-class was produced by the Republic Engineering Corporation (REC) which was a new manufacturer founded by the NR themselves shortly after Endor and they had their headquarters on Coruscant.
As for the paintjobs of the Nebula & Endurance I’ve also seen people making comparisons to the pairing of Victory I/Venator for the Old Republic.
So maybe this is intentional.
If one compares both the Republic and the Nebula more to the Victory I and the Venator, I’d say their specs and abilties would be more “realistic” anyways.
I think no one here disputes the fact that the Nebulon-B can’t hope to go toe-to-toe with a Victory, but the various NR light destroyers have a bunch of odd characteristics that I think can be explained.
If we can all agree that baseline power generation technology in Star Wars is relatively stagnant, a 1200 meter Republic-Class destroyer can’t hope to exceed an Imperator in reactor output given its hull form, but if it sacrifices shielding and thrust while packing on huge capacitor racks and missile banks, surpassing an Imperator in firepower by 20% for a few minutes should be feasible. A 700m Majestic has no chance against an Imperator regardless of how much of its hull is stuffed with capacitor.
I still kind of disagree with Fractal’s system defense gunboat concept. A 20th century motor torpedo boat is a viable asset against a dreadnought because a single well-placed Whitehead torpedo only takes seconds to line up a shot, but it can sink or heavily damage any battleship or armored cruiser, while the launch platform is able to rapidly withdraw into fogbanks/smokescreens/cover of small islands/the night. In Star Wars, you can’t really pull off that sort of maneuver against alert targets, especially if all you have to work with are capacitor fed HTL against shielded destroyer/cruiser weight targets.
My personal theory for the Republic/Nebula is that of the classic offensive hyperspace raid ship. Jump in with overwhelming numbers (5-1?) on ships not at general quarters, static shipyards, deepdocks, refineries, Altors, C3I facilities, and maybe even the Validusia if you’ve got enough of them. Unload capacitors/ordnance on target, and get out before reinforcements show up. Besides, new construction historically tends to be assigned to high-prestige offensive formations after shaking up, leaving the system defense role to slower legacy Mon-Cal platforms.
Speaking of the fishtanks, I never bought the idea that the MC80s were converted luxury liners in the classic sense. Sure, a 14th century cog can function adequately as both a warship and merchant transport, but the more advanced technology gets, the more civilian and military hulls differ in construction and form. It has been said before, but the more likely option is the Mon Calamari building MC80s to warship grade hull integrity and power generation standards while labeling them as cruise ships in order to amass a fleet without the Empire figuring it out too early.
Now the Endurance is an interesting vessel. Starships Of The Galaxy and Cracken both put it at 2 wings of fighters, but as a dedicated carrier at 1000m, 2 wings of 36 fighters under the New Republic system is pathetic. Even under the Imperial system of 72 fighters per wing, 144 fighters is still awful for a carrier compared to the similarly sized multirole Venator at nearly 500 fighters while still being an excellent fast destroyer. I’d retcon the Endurance to carry 16 New Republic fighter wings in order to be competitive, and 16 wings of 32 E-Wings/K-Wings loaded for heavy anti-ship strike are probably enough to pose a credible threat to an Imperial destroyer.
I like the idea of Stridents/Mediators/Viscounts/Bellator defectors doing most of the heavy lifting against the remaining remnant battlecruisers and dreadnaughts, but the problem with the old EU was the relentless minimalism when it went to ship numbers/sizes. I think one source actually pegged Nebula construction at only 1 a year, which is just… nugh. For the Strident, I found a interestingly decent model with a sizable centerline battery. http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars-exodus/images/2/27/Strident.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20080419232141
Fractal there is a problem I’m having with Something Big – StarDestroyer.Net BBS
Very late post but it is working again.
Oh, the Praetor. What a beautiful beast. It’s great to have those comparison shots with the ISD, btw.
Those thruster clusters (plus dorsal secondaries) make for a neat display indeed when lit up. Plus, choice comparison shots-I suppose you stuck with this render’s original intended tonnage (as opposed to the EGTW’s shaving off roughly an Impstar & change)?
This is currently scaled to the EGTW 4.8km figure.
Further evidence I need to update my prescription, then.
Ooo the Praetor engine’s yellow glow (Same colour as the Altor) is beautiful.
By away Fractal are you going to give us the armament of this ship?